Room 215

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Posts by Room 215

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  13

  WTF???

  by headisspinning in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  http://www.seanet.com/~raines/review.html.

  the society at the time believed that some demons or fallen angels were honest and could be saved and return to god's organization.

  [6] angels and women, they believed, was channeled or "dictated" to the author by one such fallen angel who was honest and told the truth about pre-flood conditions on earth.

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  Room 215

  Snoozy, since this was published in 1924, the endorsement is clearly Rutherford's (Russell died in 1916).
• 
  62

  June 15th WT, Trap Your Kids in the Cult

  by LostGeneration in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  the new wt is up.

  the worst article is the first one, a non-study article.

  shows pictures of a kid, looks like he is 10 years old.

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  Room 215

  Articles like these show exactly why they split off the kool-aid WT from the one for general distribution....
• 
  29

  Why was Rutherford sent to prison?

  by Alfred in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  well that was 93 years ago so well probably never know all the facts.

  but the wt claims that russell and others were falsely accused of sedition.

  the may 9, 1918 new york times article that covered these arrests and sedition charges states that they were charged with spreading doctrines calculated to promote unrest and disloyalty among the men of the army and navy.

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  Room 215

  Alfred, I appreciate your research and the excerpts, but these are hardly tantamount to sedition, and are admissable as freedom of speec. Borgia is correct in pointing out the more egregious examples of incitement to rebellion in the letters, etc. sent to members of the US miliary in the field.
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  5

  If Witnesses Really Cared......

  by metatron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  being "in" a religion and actually believing its doctrines are two different things.

  i have little doubt that there are probably many leaders in the major religions who are actually agnostics and simply go thru the motions of being faithful to whatever ritual is asked of them.. this is possible because most religions put forth some effort to help people in some organized way - whether soup kitchens, public charities, hospitals or the like.

  it gives people who are zealous - but privately heterodox - a chance to be supportive.. sadly, this will never be the case with the "truth".

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  Room 215

  The belief that all outside your cloistered walls are pleasure-mad, greedy, self-seeking, violent, sex-obsessed criminals soon to be vaporised into oblivion is hardly conducive to your development of a social conscience....
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  68

  "Something in the congregation is hindering the flow of Jehovah's holy spirit" - witch hunt JW style?

  by slimboyfat in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  has anyone else experienced something like this?.

  in my mother-in-law's congregation a special pioneer was recently moved to the congregation and he gave a talk where he said he and the other elders felt there was a bad spirit in the congregation and there must be something going on that is preventing jehovah's holy spirit from operating properly.

  but he didn't state explicity what the problem might be and now gossip is rife in the congregation about whether there might be a sinner or a traitor in their midst.. for many this is just the excuse they need to gossip and bad mouth others.

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  Room 215

  They've been trotting out that old crapola since Rutherford's time, if not before.... it's usually a prelude to a witch hunt and/or wholesale removal of elders... a from of theocractic bloodletting!
• 
  79

  Are we losing members quicker than the WT ??

  by wobble in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  reading a thread from just a few months ago, made me realise that a lot of people who used to be regular contributors here no longer do so.. i know that people have always moved on, as the anger and hurt get less, as the wt mind-set totally disappears, we feel the need to come here less and less, but because of the intelligence, insight, wit and wisdom of these people, the board is somewhat impoverished each time one of these moves on.. this is a plea to all who post now, and some who still read but don't post, please do not leave us entirely, the contributions on here are literally life-saving for many.

  it is easy to get dangerously suicidal when the whole wt pack of cards falls down for you.. please do not become a stranger to us !.

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  Room 215

  Maybe the flow of the Spirit is being obstructed here? (Remember that one?)
• 
  25

  "Has the writing always been this bad?" -- A Channel C Contributor Hits The Nail On The Head

  by Room 215 in

  1. social
  2. entertainment

  this from channel c..... .

  "a nice older lady dropped off a couple of magazines the other day.

  i hadnt read wt material recently, so decided to have a quick read of the march 1/11 wt, the good news of the kingdom what is it?.

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  Room 215

  This from Channel C.....

  "A nice older lady dropped off a couple of magazines the other day. I hadn’t read WT material recently, so decided to have a quick read of the March 1/11 WT, “The Good News of the Kingdom – What is It?”
  
  The first article, “A Prophecy of Enormous Importance”, begins with a quotation from Matthew 24:14, “The good news of the kingdom must be preached in all the inhabited earth for a witness to all the nations; and then the end will come.” The article says that “…scholars agree, [that this prophecy] is highly important.” But it doesn’t mention which scholars or in what sense it is “highly important.” (p.3) I would venture that scholars in fact don’t agree at all about the importance, exact meaning, application or timing of this prophecy.
  
  On p. 4, the article claims that “Christendom’s leaders offer conflicting, confusing, and complicated explanations…One writes that God’s Kingdom is “…an experience with God in which men and women find salvation.” However, there is no reference. They then reference a similar quotation from the Catechism of the Catholic church: “The kingdom of God [is] righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit”, as if this was completely off base, when in fact it is almost a verbatim quotation from Paul (Ro 14:17). The first quotation could also be supported by Ro 14:17. Did the writer not know this or not bother to look it up? The WTS is now in the unenvious position of opposing the apostle Paul.
  
  And this brings up another problem. In the previous paragraph, “…scholars agree…” is used to prove their point. But in this paragraph, “Christendom’s leaders”, which I assume are scholars, are in a state of confusion. So are they dependable or not? You can’t have it both ways.
  
  On p.5, the writer tells us that, “…Jesus assured his faithful apostles that they, along with others, would be resurrected to heaven and would sit on thrones. (Luke 22:28:30)”. The writer assures us that these thrones are symbolic since there aren't realy thrones in heaven. Yet the scripture cited says nothing about heaven, only about sitting on thrones. Citations must support your assertion and this one doesn't.
  
  The writer then accuses churches which do social work, or build hospitals or schools of having ulterior motives: only to gain disciples. It never occurs to the writer that these may be doing these good works out of sincere concern for other people. Maybe the WTS should try doing this. (p.6)
  
  Again, we have a non-reference to “One theologian [that] writes…” Which theologian? Where and when was this written? (p.6)
  
  The writer then makes a major gaff by ridiculing Catholics for thinking that the best way to preach the good news is “…by living their life in such as way that it would be an example to others” and then praising JWs for doing exactly the same thing (p.8). Sorry, WTS, as before, you can’t have it both ways.
  
  The article, if handed in as a paper to any self-respecting school would be a fail. If submitted to any decent magazine would be rejected. There isn’t even an attempt to adhere to basic journalistic standards. The article contradicts itself in a number of places. Citations are missing or misused. It is very poorly done. If the WTS wants to be credible (and I assume that it does), it could start by introducing generally accepted journalistic practices into their writing department. The situation is even more desperate considering these magazines are for public, not internal, consumption (at least that’s my understanding).
  
  What is going on here? Has the writing always been this bad but I just now noticed it? Or is it deteriorating as we get "closer to the end?"
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  40

  assemblies; how times have changed

  by Evidently Apostate in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my wife mentioned our circuit assembly was this weekend, she looked at me and i let out a chuckle and said "the kids are too sick right?

  " (they weren't) but it was what she wanted to hear, an excuse from me to blow it off.

  it got us thinking about how they were kind of tolerable when we were younger.. meals with ice cream, lots of volunteering to get you out of your seat.. there was more room at past assemblies.

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  Room 215

  Over here, they did a really good job with baked chicken! Could never get it so "falling-off-the-bone" tender at home!
• 
  21

  What are some feel good foods?

  by Iamallcool in

  1. jw
  2. friends

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  Room 215

  soups, of course.... here's one of the best articles ever on the subject: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/06/magazine/06eat-t.html?ref=dining
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  39

  using the name "jehovah"

  by finallyfree! in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i find it to be frankly disrespectful.

  im a father, if my kids were to call me by my first name id find that wierd.

  we address judges with "your honor" and various other titles, so why on earth would we call the almighty god by his first name?

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  Room 215

  I always felt that the common off-handed use of the divine name -- "Jehovah this" and "Jehovah" -- almost as a talisman -- is actually an abuse of it, as it cheapens it, deprives it of its rightful awe and reverence. It also diminishes his status as the omnipotent creator to that of a tribal god -- the baddest dude on the block -- but still one of many and therefore needful of a name to distinguish himself from a rather undistguished pack of lesser gods.